RICHMOND, Va. -- Glenn Davidson and Butch Earnheart drive by Community High School in Richmond almost every day.
The two contractors have been steadily working together on a home within walking distance of the school, and almost every afternoon during the school week, they see multiple school buses lined up outside of the school on Woodrow Avenue.
It's a spot where both Davidson and Earnheart said they drive cautiously.
But last month, both men were slapped with two separate $250 fines for allegedly passing a school bus with its stop sign out, a violation of Virginia law.
They each got two separate tickets, in the same spot, at almost the same time, though on different days.
Both men told CBS 6 they did not see the stop sign along the row of buses, any flashing lights, or any students or staff moving around the area on either day.
"You can see the shadow of another bus covering it," Davidson said while he pointed to photos attached to one of his tickets. "I've never seen anything like this."
"We weren't aware that we were doing something," Earnheart said.
According to Richmond Public Schools, cameras inside district school buses, tickets, and all fees are managed externally by a third-party company called Bus Alert.
Both Earnheart and Davidson's tickets gave them options to appeal online or by phone, but warned if they were found guilty of violating Virginia Code, they may have to pay an additional fine and their driving record may be impacted.
Davidson said he went to Richmond City Hall to see if he could get some in-person help after he spent almost half an hour on the phone with Bus Alert.
“All it is, is a recording. Press one to do this, press three to pay, press four to contest, and you can’t get a live person, and the Clerk of Court says they can’t get live people on the phone either," Davidson said.
According to Richmond Public Schools, the district has no visibility into who may receive a ticket from the camera, or where, because it's an automated system.
A RPS spokesperson said a stop sign is only out with the lights on, and it is the law that you can't pass a bus with its sign out, even if people do not see any students.
The spokesperson said Community High School students may be heading to Richmond Technical Center for classes.
Richmond Police told CBS 6 that a sworn officer was required to review each potential violation captured by a bus's camera system and verify using the images captured of the vehicle approaching, passing and departing from an activated stop arm on a school bus.
Once verified, the officer issues the violation.
Duplicate tickets may have been issued due to multiple automated cameras being used at the time.
According to RPD's Special Operations Division, which enforces the program, fees from the program are directed to program costs and Richmond Public Schools.
According to the Virginia Department of Motor Vehicles, drivers must stop when school buses are stopping with flashing red lights, or an extended stop sign when approaching from any direction. Drivers must remain stopped until everyone is clear, and the bus moves again.
Drivers must stop whenever the bus is loading or unloading passengers, even if the lights and stop signs are not activated.
Both Davidson and Earnheart say they want to see more consistency in how stop signs are used in the area, and what the expectations are for drivers.
"If you do see the arm sticking out, and they're in the process of maybe loading, do you stop and wait 20 minutes for them to load the bus, or do you just kind of back up and go the other direction?" Earnheart said.
"Are you supposed to guess? Or slam on brakes for bus #3 when you see the sign, when busses #1 and #2 are blocking everything?" Davidson asked.
They also wondered if the process of trying to appeal a ticket through the program deterred other drivers from appealing at all.
"How many people have paid these, thousands of dollars, wrongly? And nobody's been there to help them or say, 'Guess what, this is wrong?'" Davidson said.
Have you experienced similar issues? Email the CBS 6 Newsroom if you have information to share.
